{"@context":"http://iiif.io/api/presentation/3/context.json","id":"https://arsc.aviaryplatform.com/iiif/k35m902p38/manifest","type":"Manifest","label":{"en":["Indigitization: A Practical Relationship-based Approach to Indigenous Community-Based Digitization"]},"logo":"https://d9jk7wjtjpu5g.cloudfront.net/organizations/logo_images/000/000/019/original/ARSC_Full_Logo_RGB_K.jpg?1605438091","metadata":[{"label":{"en":["Agent"]},"value":{"en":["Lawson, Gerry (Presenter)","McManus, Elizabeth (Presenter)","Yuri Shimoda (Moderator)","Dan Hockstein (Moderator)"]}},{"label":{"en":["Date"]},"value":{"en":["2021-03-25 (Created)"]}},{"label":{"en":["Description"]},"value":{"en":["\u003cp\u003eGerry Lawson and Elizabeth McManus discuss the Indigitization Program which has supported the digitization of almost 12,000 audio cassettes in British Columbia, Canada, its origins, and work with the Musqueam community.\u003c/p\u003e\r\n\u003cp\u003eGerry Lawson is a member of the Heiltsuk First Nation. He manages the Oral History and Language Lab at the UBC Museum of Anthropology and oversees technology and training for the innovative Indigitization Program. Elizabeth McManus is the senior archivist for Musqueam Indian Band Archives.\u003c/p\u003e\r\n\u003cp\u003eThe speakers deliver a 45-minute presentation followed by 15 minutes of Q\u0026amp;A.\u003c/p\u003e (abstract)"]}},{"label":{"en":["Language"]},"value":{"en":["English (Primary)"]}},{"label":{"en":["Publisher"]},"value":{"en":["Association for Recorded Sound Collections"]}}],"summary":{"en":["\u003cp\u003eGerry Lawson and Elizabeth McManus discuss the Indigitization Program which has supported the digitization of almost 12,000 audio cassettes in British Columbia, Canada, its origins, and work with the Musqueam community.\u003c/p\u003e\r\n\u003cp\u003eGerry Lawson is a member of the Heiltsuk First Nation. He manages the Oral History and Language Lab at the UBC Museum of Anthropology and oversees technology and training for the innovative Indigitization Program. Elizabeth McManus is the senior archivist for Musqueam Indian Band Archives.\u003c/p\u003e\r\n\u003cp\u003eThe speakers deliver a 45-minute presentation followed by 15 minutes of Q\u0026amp;A.\u003c/p\u003e"]},"provider":[{"id":"https://arsc.aviaryplatform.com/aboutus","type":"Agent","label":{"en":["Association for Recorded Sound Collections"]},"homepage":[{"id":"https://arsc.aviaryplatform.com/","type":"Text","label":{"en":["Association for Recorded Sound Collections"]},"format":"text/html"}],"logo":[{"id":"https://d9jk7wjtjpu5g.cloudfront.net/organizations/logo_images/000/000/019/original/ARSC_Full_Logo_RGB_K.jpg?1605438091","type":"Image"}]}],"thumbnail":[{"id":"https://d9jk7wjtjpu5g.cloudfront.net/collection_resource_files/thumbnails/000/111/110/small/ARSC_webinar_series_Indigitization.jpg?1636647108","type":"Image","format":"image/jpeg"}],"items":[{"id":"https://arsc.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1249/collection_resources/39621/file/111110","type":"Canvas","label":{"en":["Media File 1 of 1 - ARSC_webinar_20210325_Lawson.mp4"]},"duration":4154.96533,"width":640,"height":360,"thumbnail":[{"id":"https://d9jk7wjtjpu5g.cloudfront.net/collection_resource_files/thumbnails/000/111/110/small/ARSC_webinar_series_Indigitization.jpg?1636647108","type":"Image","format":"image/jpeg"}],"items":[{"id":"https://arsc.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1249/collection_resources/39621/file/111110/content/1","type":"AnnotationPage","items":[{"id":"https://arsc.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1249/collection_resources/39621/file/111110/content/1/annotation/1","type":"Annotation","motivation":"painting","body":{"id":"https://aviary-p-arsc.s3.wasabisys.com/collection_resource_files/resource_files/000/111/110/original/ARSC_webinar_20210325_Lawson.mp4?1617550760","type":"Video","format":"video/mp4","duration":4154.96533,"width":640,"height":360},"target":"https://arsc.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1249/collection_resources/39621/file/111110","metadata":[]}]}],"annotations":[{"id":"https://arsc.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1249/collection_resources/39621/file/111110/transcript/34390","type":"AnnotationPage","label":{"en":["ARSC_webinar_20210325_Lawson_transcript [Transcript]"]},"items":[{"id":"https://arsc.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1249/collection_resources/39621/file/111110/transcript/34390/annotation/1","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"My name is Dan Hockstein. I'm an audio preservation engineer at UNC Chapel Hill and also a part-time information science student at the university. Just want to take a moment to acknowledge Chapel Hill sits in the land of the Occaneechi, Shakori, Eno, and Sissipahaw peoples. I do want to recognize the land and sovereignty of those nations on which I'm fortunate enough to live and work. \n\nYuri Shimoda","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arsc.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1249/collection_resources/39621/file/111110#t=6.0,33.0"},{"id":"https://arsc.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1249/collection_resources/39621/file/111110/transcript/34390/annotation/2","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Hello, everyone, I am Yuri Shimoda. I am coming to you today from Tovaangar, the traditional, ancestral, and unceded territory of the Gabrielino-Tongva Peoples. I am an archivist at the UCLA Ethnomusicology Archive and a faculty member in the UCLA Herb Alpert School of Music. \n\nDan Hockstein","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arsc.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1249/collection_resources/39621/file/111110#t=33.0,59.0"},{"id":"https://arsc.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1249/collection_resources/39621/file/111110/transcript/34390/annotation/3","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And in case you followed one of the wonderful things sent out by our outreach committee and are unsure about our school, and we'll talk to you a little bit about ARSC, The Association for Recorded Sound Collections. ARSC is a nonprofit organization dedicated to the preservation and study of sound recordings, in all genres of music and speech, in all formats, and from all periods. We're a unique organization in bringing together private individuals and institutional representatives, everyone with a serious interest in recorded sound. The association is supporting this continuing education webinar series as a resource to the community. Please do consider supporting ARSC and ARSC-audio.org/donate if you have the means. \n\nYuri Shimoda","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arsc.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1249/collection_resources/39621/file/111110#t=59.0,112.0"},{"id":"https://arsc.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1249/collection_resources/39621/file/111110/transcript/34390/annotation/4","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Once again, thank you all for coming. The format for today's event will be about a forty-five minute long presentation by our two guest speakers, followed by about 15 minutes of Q\u0026A time. The recording of this webinar will be available via ARSC's Aviary website. If you haven't attended a webinar before, please visit that site to see the recording of webinar one. I wanted to also mention that ARSC's annual conference is coming up. It will be virtual May 12th through 15th, and we'll share a little bit more information on the conference at the end of the webinar. But without further ado, I would like to introduce Gerry Lawson and Elizabeth McManus, our guests for today. Gerry, go ahead and take it away. \n\nGerry Lawson","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arsc.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1249/collection_resources/39621/file/111110#t=112.0,168.0"},{"id":"https://arsc.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1249/collection_resources/39621/file/111110/transcript/34390/annotation/5","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Hi, Yuri and Dan. Thank you so much for inviting us. I haven't been a supporter of ARSC, but I have certainly used resources and listservs from the community and I think a lot of practices are based on synthesizing things, the conversations that come out of these associations. So we really appreciate being here and, yeah, are really interested to hear from people. And I'm going to share. So hopefully, you can all see that. As I awkwardly move other things out of the way.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arsc.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1249/collection_resources/39621/file/111110#t=168.0,217.0"},{"id":"https://arsc.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1249/collection_resources/39621/file/111110/transcript/34390/annotation/6","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So, as was mentioned, my name is Gerry Lawson, and I'm from the Heiltsuk Nation. It's a community that's about, I think, 500 kilometers north of Vancouver, right along the coast, and my Heiltsuk name is Malagius. We didn't give, I'm going to be honest, a lot of thought to the title of the presentation. So I kind of arranged it like a Christmas tree to make it more interesting. And for something that has a relationship-based, I don't talk as much about relationships as I should in the actual presentation. It's a little more of the history of indigitization, but I will sort of introduce our steering committee at some point a little bit further on.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arsc.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1249/collection_resources/39621/file/111110#t=217.0,269.0"},{"id":"https://arsc.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1249/collection_resources/39621/file/111110/transcript/34390/annotation/7","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So, to give a little bit of context, I work at the UBC Museum of Anthropology in Vancouver. It is a museum that Elizabeth has actually worked at as well. That's where we met. And it's known for the architecture. It was designed by Arthur Erickson, prominent Canadian architect. We're really known for our Potlatch Collection, a collection of cultural heritage belongings from our communities along the coast and the art of Bill Reed a prominent Haida artist.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arsc.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1249/collection_resources/39621/file/111110#t=269.0,309.0"},{"id":"https://arsc.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1249/collection_resources/39621/file/111110/transcript/34390/annotation/8","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Now, this work of digitizing cultural heritage is very personal to me. So this is my father, Chester Lawson. And I've reformatted my presentation from a four by three and at some point all of the pictures became potato quality. So you'll just have to put up with that. I will replace them at some point. And my father carries the name Qvuikvia, which is one of the yimas from our community, or a chief, is what it would be more generally known as. And he is always really put on my sisters and I, the importance of supporting culture and heritage and language revival within our community. And that hasn't been an easy thing. And especially for me. I do a lot of speaking, but I'm really not comfortable in front of people, and especially singing and dancing, and we have a performative culture.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arsc.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1249/collection_resources/39621/file/111110#t=309.0,364.0"},{"id":"https://arsc.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1249/collection_resources/39621/file/111110/transcript/34390/annotation/9","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So at some point, probably in my late teens, early 20s, I got a tour of what they call the vault at the Heiltsuk Cultural Education Center in Bella Bella. This is the organization that has the mandate for preserving Heiltsuk culture and heritage materials in the community. It's a resource center. And what I saw was thousands of audiotapes and half-inch open reel video and quarter-inch open real audio and every Camcorder format that they had at the time and VHS and Beta. So pretty much every media format that you can think of in a consumer, like, non broadcast realm, was in that room. And it's a fairly small room, but it was packed with media that even at the time, they couldn't play all the formats safely. They didn't have machines for everything that they had. They were already suffering from media format obsolescence in the '80s.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arsc.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1249/collection_resources/39621/file/111110#t=364.0,433.0"},{"id":"https://arsc.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1249/collection_resources/39621/file/111110/transcript/34390/annotation/10","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So to give a bit more context, there are there 70 indigenous languages in Canada and 34 of them are in British Columbia. So we have 203 First Nations communities, over 90 dialects. B.C. is a place of incredible diversity. And if you think back to that image of piles and piles of media, that is in every one of those communities. In all of our communities we have this media that was recorded by community members within community projects for traditional use studies, oral histories, by externals, by repatriated collections that come from linguists and musical ethnomusicologists. Trying to think of the different designations that people put on themselves as they came in and extracted culture from our communities. But we are talking about thousands of media objects and pretty much every community. And at the time that I had taken the tour through the vault, I thought, OK, this I can do. I'm a little bit technical. I could help my community to modernize the formats of this media. And I didn't have a sort of full sense of what that meant, but that was something that I felt could be part of helping my community with culture and language revitalization.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arsc.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1249/collection_resources/39621/file/111110#t=433.0,526.0"},{"id":"https://arsc.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1249/collection_resources/39621/file/111110/transcript/34390/annotation/11","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And then if you fast forward a decade or so, my sister Kim, who is a librarian and archivist, was the head of the Resource Center at the Union B.C. Indian Chiefs Resource Center. And they are one of those organizations that has thousands upon thousands of media objects in every one of the media formats, including Umatic and half-inch open reel video, a lot of quite problematic formats. And they serve a lot of different communities and had an urgency in digitizing. So I started to work with Kim when I was sort of in-between careers, I would say. And we started to do digitization projects. Applying for grants, putting together our own equipment, buying things. Really what I would call ghetto digitization.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arsc.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1249/collection_resources/39621/file/111110#t=526.0,581.0"},{"id":"https://arsc.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1249/collection_resources/39621/file/111110/transcript/34390/annotation/12","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"We put together some really innovative projects, but what we were running into was frustrations around funding, where any funding for digitization, the biggest funding pool in British Columbia, was not for preservation, it was for access. So any cost around preservation were not eligible. You couldn't buy hard drives. You couldn't buy archival containers for things. You couldn't do conservation work. They would only fund access. And yet, all best practices you read told you that you could only digitize for preservation and then worry about access afterwards. And it's not that we had a problem with those. They were just incompatible in terms of the funding that was available and the practices that were, I'm going to say, demanded. Within every pot of money was open access. And Elizabeth can speak a bit more to this from a policy level, but from a protocol level, indigenous knowledge, which has been transferred orally and transferred by people who had the purview to repeat stories or knowledge, would tell them to the people who may have the ability to retell them, or may have only the ability to listen. And as a listener, you had the responsibility of acknowledging that you heard and heard properly, and then you were responsible for acknowledging whether somebody continued to tell a story or convey knowledge properly. \n\nGerry Lawson","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arsc.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1249/collection_resources/39621/file/111110#t=581.0,681.0"},{"id":"https://arsc.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1249/collection_resources/39621/file/111110/transcript/34390/annotation/13","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"It's something that Western information protocol would not allow. The demand for open access really wasn't something that would apply to any indigenous collection that I knew about. That there is no indigenous collection that you could simply make large portions of it open access. And British Columbia, where we work, is also in a sort of strange position. Canada created treaties more or less from east to west. And when they got to the Rockies and found the diversity in British Columbia, there are very few treaties in British Columbia, so a tremendous amount of our recordings are specific claims that are around indigenous rights and title. And they come with Western access protocols around who can access information based on the consents that were given during the time of capture. So open access simply was a nonstarter for every indigenous collection that that I knew about. And then on top of that, any archival funding in Canada came with the requirement for open office hours, access to the public, open access, environmental controls, things that no indigenous organization I know met the requirements for.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arsc.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1249/collection_resources/39621/file/111110#t=681.0,776.0"},{"id":"https://arsc.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1249/collection_resources/39621/file/111110/transcript/34390/annotation/14","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And, there we go. So, moving into the way that practices were articulated. In trying to do the research to figure out how to digitize, we found that pretty much everybody just parroted best practices, IASA-TCO4 and different best practice documents. That what I found that was available in terms of guides were either too basic or too complicated. It was either one page of bullet points or it was Sound Directions, a 90-page manual that was really, you had to be an audio engineer to read. The jargon was impenetrable from either the audio or video broadcast engineer side or from the information management side. And those practices simply were unrealistic. The specifications that were given didn't match any new equipment that could be purchased for the most part, and you couldn't guarantee. Repair people weren't available widely, and there was no way to do a lot of measurements to figure out whether or not your equipment was within best practice guidelines. And I've since taken best practice guidelines as suggestions and done the best practical job I can of obtaining equipment and doing a safe job of transfers. But at the time, we were being told that this everything was You must, must, must, you must never, never, never. And those things were paralyzing. And what I would say is that when I encountered recent professionals in information management, people coming out of the the library school at UBC, people were only taught best practices. Very few people had experienced digitizing and had the opportunity to get experience digitizing during library school. So they would come out, they would be the young and professionals that indigenous communities could afford. They were hired to write reports for digitizing to help communities move forward, and they would just summarize best practices that never scaled to actual practices. Things that just simply couldn't be implemented.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arsc.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1249/collection_resources/39621/file/111110#t=776.0,914.0"},{"id":"https://arsc.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1249/collection_resources/39621/file/111110/transcript/34390/annotation/15","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And I used to talk a lot about that. I don't like to talk about that part as much anymore because I think the landscape has changed. I think people are softening in the way they communicate about digitization. I think that our program has had an effect on the way practices are communicated, at least around British Columbia and in Canada. And so I think there's there's been movement in the community at large to develop better actual practices for people to follow actual guides. So this again, excuse the quality of the picture, but that's my office. So a few years into doing work with a number of indigenous community organizations, I was hired at the Museum of Anthropology to be the first manager of the Oral History and Language Lab. And really, it was about if you look in the background, there's a recording booth. And it was really about original recording. And what we have found in the time that it was part of a $55 million expansion project that was a little bit under-thought for the Oral History and Language Lab in that in the time it took to build that building, high-quality, portable digital audio recorders had become a thing. And the sound booth, UBC is not close to anything or on the way to or from anything. It's you have to really go out of your way to get to us. And so the sound booth would not occupy all of my time. So I sort of brought my digitization experience to the Oral History Lab as a thing that we would support at least as much as born digital recording.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arsc.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1249/collection_resources/39621/file/111110#t=914.0,1027.0"},{"id":"https://arsc.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1249/collection_resources/39621/file/111110/transcript/34390/annotation/16","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And shortly after, I was lucky enough to be asked to participate in the indigenization pilot project, something that was funded out of the UBC library system and was really meant to address some of those, the gap in practices and what people were told to do versus what they could do. And what I was asked to do was simply, what hardware can what should we buy to lend to community for digitizing audio cassettes? And they wanted to start with something that was relatively simple. And the problem with that is you can't just send a bunch of boxes to somebody who doesn't work in digital preservation and expect them to assemble the hardware properly, know what software to use, know what file formats to go to, and know how to name their their media and their files.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arsc.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1249/collection_resources/39621/file/111110#t=1027.0,1074.0"},{"id":"https://arsc.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1249/collection_resources/39621/file/111110/transcript/34390/annotation/17","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So, my first thought was, OK, well, I have to actually write instructions. I have to make sure it works together, make sure there aren't incompatibilities we didn't know about. So I have to buy the equipment, assemble it and just make sure it works. And my boss Ann Stephenson said, Well, that's still not enough. You have to get people planning advice and you have to help people to not make it more ephemeral in the digital realm than it was in the physical.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arsc.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1249/collection_resources/39621/file/111110#t=1074.0,1100.0"},{"id":"https://arsc.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1249/collection_resources/39621/file/111110/transcript/34390/annotation/18","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So what we ended up with was a, don't want to say a portable kit, it was a kit entirely mounted within a gator case that has seven cables that come out of the back, including the one you plug into the wall with everything labeled that's really easily put together. And this in and of itself was a huge step forward for helping people to digitize in them not knowing that it's not their fault if something's not working properly. It's my fault. So we've had at this point, dozens of people over the years put this together, and nobody's ever felt like they've put it together incorrectly. And that in of itself was great. But we also developed a 90-page manual for digitizing the simplest format there is to digitize. That includes forms and condition assessment and some planning advice and at least sort of justifies what our choices were.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arsc.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1249/collection_resources/39621/file/111110#t=1100.0,1155.0"},{"id":"https://arsc.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1249/collection_resources/39621/file/111110/transcript/34390/annotation/19","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And at this point, I kind of I've called indigenization a protest project against best practices. I don't anymore. It's grown. It's beyond that. But it really was about becoming a lightning rod. People wanted to be negative about practices, they could come to me. And to be frank, nobody ever has. Nobody's ever analyzed it in terms of best practices and specifications and total harmonic distortion. People are just happy it's there.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arsc.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1249/collection_resources/39621/file/111110#t=1155.0,1185.0"},{"id":"https://arsc.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1249/collection_resources/39621/file/111110/transcript/34390/annotation/20","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"This is the kit being tested at my own community, at the Heiltsuk Culture Education Center where this all started for me. And that's Jennifer Carpenter, who's been the head of the Culture Education Center since its was formed. Rory Housty, who's gone on to become a language teacher in the community. And they are testing the procedures for the first kit we ever developed. And we knew that we probably had a good thing when they didn't send it back. They just told us to send them a bill. So that kit is still in Bella Bella. And it's been digitizing tapes for about six years before the tape deck had to be sent away for repairs. And they've since gotten another kit that's really similar and able to help them do more digitization out in the community. And if you look at the wall behind them, behind that display, is actually where the vault is, where those thousands of media objects that I first sort of discovered and thought that I might be able to help.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arsc.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1249/collection_resources/39621/file/111110#t=1185.0,1243.0"},{"id":"https://arsc.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1249/collection_resources/39621/file/111110/transcript/34390/annotation/21","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So it's really quite a privilege for me to have been able to work my own community in that pilot project to bring something practical. And I have no idea where I'm on time because I've forgotten to start my clock. So I'm guessing that I'm almost up and I'm probably about halfway through the talk. But this is what happens after a pilot project, and this is what we really didn't want to happen. So we went back to UBC Library, the Irving K. Barber Learning Center that operates on endowment, and asked for that slide is out of order. Asked for basically some money to send it to a community, maybe bring it back, send it to another community and abandon it there so it would do some good. And what they what we ended up with with the back pocket ask is they invested in turning it into a grant fund. And so the indigitization grant started at that point, off of the cassette resources that we developed.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arsc.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1249/collection_resources/39621/file/111110#t=1243.0,1304.0"},{"id":"https://arsc.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1249/collection_resources/39621/file/111110/transcript/34390/annotation/22","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And through our understandings of where the gaps are and where learning has to happen, we've brought in hand-holding for people who are creating their grant projects. We do a lot of help with the project planning and budgeting and preparation. This is elder Larry Grant from the Musqueam community giving a welcome to the community. And that's actually the guy with the beard is Kevin Owen, who's actually works with Elizabeth, and is helping us with the expansion project. There are a number of, Elizabeth, is that Nancy on the other side? Yeah, so. So this is actually a lot of the team that Elizabeth works with on a daily basis. But this is elder Larry Grant being brought in to welcome our indigenization grant recipients and to talk about projects and to talk about language and talk about revitalization. And bringing people together in a week long training session was a major part of the indigenization program for a long time. And it allowed for cohorts. It allowed for people to become each other's support systems. It allowed for people to learn together. It allowed for people to sort of ask questions and for different. It's really interesting where different people took the lead and where different people sort of stepped up and the different sort of partnerships that develop that wouldn't be expected generationally or otherwise.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arsc.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1249/collection_resources/39621/file/111110#t=1304.0,1397.0"},{"id":"https://arsc.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1249/collection_resources/39621/file/111110/transcript/34390/annotation/23","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"We also introduce people to the people at University of British Columbia who work really well with communities. And that's the language program on the left is actually touring the Xwi7xwa Library, which is the only First Nations academic library in Canada, and they're finding a language report that was lost to the community, that even the author didn't have a copy of it, and they found a copy. And at the end of the day they left with a physical and a digital copy of this language report. So we're finding that there's extra benefit to introducing people to different people, parts and practices. And this is touring the Museum of Anthropology. And it's worth noting that I do a lot of work with archival communities and museum communities, and the archival community is probably about 20 years behind the museum community in terms of practices around belonging and cultural protocol for access and relationships building.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arsc.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1249/collection_resources/39621/file/111110#t=1397.0,1457.0"},{"id":"https://arsc.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1249/collection_resources/39621/file/111110/transcript/34390/annotation/24","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So this is the impact to date of indigitization, about 45 projects and 34 communities, and we've helped to digitize almost 12000 cassettes, and I'm sure that number is much more with what people have done outside of funding. And I'm going to just quickly wrap it up, pretty sure I'm at time. But back in 2016, we held something called the Indigitization Futures Forum, which we brought together a lot of important people to us from both community and information management to figure out what the outstanding gaps were. And we found out it's a lot of advocacy around funding, around additional funding for things that aren't funded by us and that we can't fund at levels needed, but also different formats. So we've had a number of partnerships develop, but we're coming to the tail end of something called the Indigitization Expansion Project, where we've developed about 350 new pages of guides for VHS, Betamax, Camcorder formats, updating our cassette guide, including micro cassette and mini cassette, and putting together open reel guides for open reel audio. And all of this, as soon as we can, will be ported to freely accessible, online courses that people can take. To get the in-person training was extremely important and extremely helpful, but it also made me a bottleneck in the process. So having online guides that anybody can access from anywhere is going to get myself out of the way as an impediment to helping people digitize.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arsc.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1249/collection_resources/39621/file/111110#t=1457.0,1568.0"},{"id":"https://arsc.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1249/collection_resources/39621/file/111110/transcript/34390/annotation/25","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And I am very quickly, before Elizabeth shames me with showing her team, this is our steering committee. Alissa Cherry was the head of the Union of B.C. Indian Chiefs Research Centera after my sister. And my sister is now at the Residential School History and Dialog Center at UBC. Sarah DuPont has been our program manager for quite a few years and now she's recently moved up to become UBC Librarian at Xwa7xwa Library and is still our the head of our program. But we've hired Kyla Larson as our producer, program manager. Michael Wynne is a, he works with the Sustainable Heritage Network at Washington State University and has been working with us in Vancouver, and he's now in Victoria. But his work with Mukurtu and with Sustainable Heritage Network sort of brings valuable information to us about how what we do can be better aligned with what other organizations who do similar things do. And Erica Hernandez Reed is the archivist at the University of Northern B.C. And when she came on board, it really helped us to understand the geographic gaps we had in serving the province of British Columbia in that the pins on that map, there was a lot that wasn't in the northeast section. And since Erika joined us, she brings her relationships around sort of good archival storage agreements and relationships with communities in the northeast and central part of the province, and has really sort of rounded out how we support different parts of the province that we didn't know we had a problem with supporting. And most recently, Amy Perreault has joined us, who is with the Center for Teaching Learning Technology at UBC and has been a supporter of ours for quite a few years. And she brings valuable, valuable experience in the education realm that will be put it put to work immediately for the online guides. So sorry for going over time. I will, if I can, get back control of my mouse again. Relinquished control. OK, there we go. So hopefully that was informative. And to you, Elizabeth. \n\nElizabeth McManus","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arsc.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1249/collection_resources/39621/file/111110#t=1568.0,1722.0"},{"id":"https://arsc.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1249/collection_resources/39621/file/111110/transcript/34390/annotation/26","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Thanks. OK, here we go. So hopefully, everyone can see that. If you can't, somebody will let me know, hopefully. I love listening to Gerry talk. You know, really, he should have probably taken the whole time. I'm always learning from him, and I'm thankful that he invited me to talk about what we're doing at Musqueam. So I'll begin just by saying that I work for the Musqueam Band and the Musqueam community. I am currently working from home, which is on the traditional unceded territory of the Musqueam people. And I do have a little map here and I can't see anybody who's watching, but I'm sure some of you are turning your heads to look at this sideways. It's not sideways because I wanted to make it bigger and fit on the screen, but I have been learning from some of our elders and the people in the language department and in the Henqemeneh language, which is spoken by the Musqueam people, we look at the land a little bit differently. So we don't, there are no cardinal directions in the language. You think about and orientate yourself on the land in terms of the mountains and the water. So I liked to start thinking about, when I look at maps, looking at the territory this way. The other sort of take away from this map is that the red line is showing the boundary sort of, of what's thought of as the primary use area. This is one-hundred and forty-four thousand eight-hundred and eighty-eight hectares of land. And Musqueam only has three-hundred and thirty-eight hectares designated to them by the Canadian government. So that's less than 0.2 percent of the original area of use that they have used throughout time.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arsc.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1249/collection_resources/39621/file/111110#t=1722.0,1878.0"},{"id":"https://arsc.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1249/collection_resources/39621/file/111110/transcript/34390/annotation/27","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Here is our team, and there was no shame intended. As I go through this talk also do remember that I am speaking from the things that I have learned from the Musqueam community and from those that I work with. I can't speak for other nations. Everyone is different. So I don't have the experience that Gerry has sort of speaking with lots of different communities. So my information is very focused just onto one, and I don't want anyone to think that I am sort of making general claims about other other groups also.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arsc.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1249/collection_resources/39621/file/111110#t=1878.0,1926.0"},{"id":"https://arsc.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1249/collection_resources/39621/file/111110/transcript/34390/annotation/28","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So here's our team, and I just like to sort of introduce everyone because there is no project that I have worked on that hasn't been in collaboration. And every one of these people are, you know, integral to any of my successes. Our department, which is Archives and Research Department, also known as Musqueam Archives, is really split into two sort of working groups. We have the records side, which Kevin Owen is our records manager, and he manages all the records that are created by people working in the administration departments and by leadership, and on top of that, collaborating on archival projects, as well. It's a massive amount of work. And then on our archive side, there's me who works, so I should preface that, so Kevin works with the active records, and then me on the archive side working with the inactive records, donations from the community, as well. Deb works on projects sort of in both realms. I actually don't think there's a project going that Deb isn't a part of at the moment. And she is also our librarian, so she has a lot of hats that she wears. Emma is our newest hire and this is such a weird environment to bring on someone new. She's been working with us for about a month now to have not even physically met her. I like to be in the same room with someone, it's just such a strange. And I couldn't imagine starting a new job and get to actually be with the people only on Zoom. And she's working on one of our database projects, but I'm sure it will not be long before she's also juggling 10 projects at once. Nancy, in the center there, started out working with Kevin. All of our indigitization projects, which I'll talk about in just a second, have been through the records side of things. We were focusing on digitizing chief and council meetings for those particular grants. But it wasn't long before I was able to coerce Nancy to sort of doing more projects on the archive side. And she really has been a driving force behind her community digitization project, which I'll hopefully have time to get to. And then finally, Jason down there in the corner, he's he's the leader of our gang. You know, I could write a book on his accomplishments, but for the sake of brevity, I'll just mention he was Musqueam's first archivist and did both archives and records work before Kevin's predecessor was hired and that he worked with Gerry in the beginning days of indigitization to really sort of help figure out, as Gerry was mentioning, a funding process that actually works for indigenous communities. OK?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arsc.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1249/collection_resources/39621/file/111110#t=1926.0,2140.0"},{"id":"https://arsc.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1249/collection_resources/39621/file/111110/transcript/34390/annotation/29","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Gerry touched on this also a little bit, but again, just speaking from what I have learned about Musqueamy community. Knowledge transmission traditionally happens in informal situations. So you're sitting around the kitchen table and you're talking, or you're out on the boat and you're fishing and you're working, but you're also talking. You know, you've gone off hunting, come back, have a deer that you're going to butcher in the back of your truck. And you're doing that work, but you're talking. And so those informal situations, plus formal situations where we think of things like funerals or gatherings in the big house is through this telling and retelling of knowledge that Musqueam people transmit this information intergenerationally. And so really, there's no need to record it mechanically. But through time, colonialization happened and Indigenous people found themselves in courtrooms battling to reclaim what was taken from them or trying to reconnect families. Excuse me, or trying to relearn a language that was no longer being learned at home from their parents. So the need to record onto magnetic media and now digitally, it became necessary through pressures like the ones that that I just mentioned. And many of our collections in Musqueam archives exists because of these pressures and the race to record everything that a knowledge holder has.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arsc.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1249/collection_resources/39621/file/111110#t=2140.0,2266.0"},{"id":"https://arsc.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1249/collection_resources/39621/file/111110/transcript/34390/annotation/30","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"OK, so. Trust and the archives. So, so much recording in the Musqueam community was done by Musqueam people working to defend their rights and title. And before I go further on this slide, I really would just like to preface to say that my intention here is not to paint the band office in poor light. They work exceptionally hard for the community and they follow cultural protocols throughout all departments. But they are an administration office and it is politically charged. And so in the past, when recordings were made of elders and knowledge holders, they were done for the purpose of defending their rights and title, as I mentioned. And there wasn't as much thought put into access and use of these records after the fact. So recordings were made and taken in to at the time was the treaty department, and they were all bundled up and labeled the archives.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arsc.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1249/collection_resources/39621/file/111110#t=2266.0,2344.0"},{"id":"https://arsc.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1249/collection_resources/39621/file/111110/transcript/34390/annotation/31","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And then every time there would be a situation where recordings, more recordings needed to be done, they would be done and treated in the same way. But due to these circumstances and how they were treated, the archives kind of ends up becoming an untrustworthy place because there isn't the thought put into how to manage these collections, how to provide access to them, who gets access to them. They were sort of bundled away, and the reputation that many archives get is that stuff gets locked away and it's never seen again. So that was sort of the case here.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arsc.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1249/collection_resources/39621/file/111110#t=2344.0,2391.0"},{"id":"https://arsc.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1249/collection_resources/39621/file/111110/transcript/34390/annotation/32","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So I think one of the things that we did, I think that really started to open us up a little bit, was physically move our space. So originally we were in the administration building in the band office. This is like a like any office building. And the particular department that we were situated in was an open office space, little cubicles everywhere. And it didn't have a comfortable, I don't want to say it wasn't comfortable, it's comfortable, but for people coming in wanting to explore, you know, the voices of the past, very emotional material, it wasn't really an appropriate situation. So we picked up and we moved to the Cultural Center, which is just a few doors down, and it made a huge difference. We were able to create a space that was comfortable, and more appropriate. And it was by doing this, and through the personal relationships that staff built with people in the community that were then becoming champions for us, that we were able to sort of start the process of gaining people's trust back.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arsc.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1249/collection_resources/39621/file/111110#t=2391.0,2481.0"},{"id":"https://arsc.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1249/collection_resources/39621/file/111110/transcript/34390/annotation/33","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So and digitization is very important to us, to me personally, because it's how I began my journey with Musqueam. The orange tubs that you see there, where tubs that Kevin recalled from offsite storage and that, I'm checking the time, sorry, and that these, all three of our rounds of indigitization were done on records management material. And that we digitized, as it says, close to a thousand hours of administration meetings, and I'm fairly confident in saying that there's no other grant program out there that would allow us to digitize chief and council meetings for three grant rounds in a row because it's just not sexy material. It's not oral history. It's not songs, it's not language. But it was so important because what we were finding is we were able to prioritize tapes for which there were no written minutes. And through that, able to identify crucial decision points in Musqueam's history that hadn't previously been captured. We found language being spoken on these tapes, which are just precious little gems. And we found many, many times over and over, knowledge holders speaking in depth on a subject that didn't get captured in the minutes, because it was likely off topic and no recording secretary is going to capture that in the minutes and they shouldn't because, it's important and everyone knows that it's important, but it's just not the point of discussion.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arsc.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1249/collection_resources/39621/file/111110#t=2481.0,2611.0"},{"id":"https://arsc.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1249/collection_resources/39621/file/111110/transcript/34390/annotation/34","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So we now have access to all of that, which we didn't have before. So indigitization and our relationship with Gerry really gave us the confidence to go out there and learn how to digitize other formats. So what came next was open reel. And then after open reel was video. And I don't know what comes after video. And then those springboarded us really into beginning our community digitization program. And this morning, this is kind of an aside, this morning I was thinking that these three rounds of indigitization were the only time that, so I did one round, Nancy did two rounds, and we worked five days a week, all day, for the duration of the grant just doing digitization work. Then we became full-time permanent staff and all digitization work now occurs off the side of our desk when we have time to carve out and work a little bit here and there. But it is no longer taking priority because we have panic priority items that sort of get pushed in front of it and it ends up taking a back seat, which is just sort of an interesting observation.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arsc.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1249/collection_resources/39621/file/111110#t=2611.0,2703.0"},{"id":"https://arsc.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1249/collection_resources/39621/file/111110/transcript/34390/annotation/35","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Community digitization is a program that we started sort of, I guess three years after I started there. And we had had several open houses and talked with community members and sort of started gaining the trust as I talked about. And people started to come forward and say, You know, I've got some stuff. So we we started with cassettes and sort of branched out to open reel and then video. We have the capacity to be able to digitize all of these formats now. And like the indigitization grant, our program focuses on providing and offering our skills and services to the community at no cost. So I mean, no costs doesn't just mean no monetary exchange, but it means that, you know, we are in archives that doesn't require anything to be permanently deposited. We don't need to maintain any copies of anything. If somebody brings something in, we digitize, we care for it, we digitize it, we give them back their original and all of the copies. If people wish for us to maintain the physical media, we can do that. If they wish for us to maintain a preservation file, we can do that. But there's no obligations on for people to have this work done for them. And if they want us to teach them how to do this work we'll sit with them and let them operate the equipment also. And Nancy has really been a driving force behind this initiative.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arsc.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1249/collection_resources/39621/file/111110#t=2703.0,2824.0"},{"id":"https://arsc.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1249/collection_resources/39621/file/111110/transcript/34390/annotation/36","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"OK. Quickly, I'm trying to go as fast as I can and please ask questions if I've skipped over anything too quickly. So, you know, we love our program, but it doesn't come without challenges. So the green ones are ones that we have, you know, sort of we feel like we we can answer most questions. And then the orange ones are ones where we sit down and talk about it, and then we end up with more questions than we have answers for. So culturally sensitive content comes up all the time. What is it? It's content that's privileged to a certain set of individuals based on a cultural criteria. So that's sort of my like, sterile definition of what it is. And there's many layers to how this is going to break down and it's going to be different in every indigenous group. And so I'm not really going to go further into it. It could be a talk all unto itself. But in terms of community digitization, it's really important for us to have honest and open and communication with any individuals that bring material in. So often people don't know what's on their tape, and with audio especially, we can easily digitize a recording without listening to it and then allow the individual to listen to it. We can either bring it to them or they can come back down into the archives, listen to it, and then we can decide on how we want to proceed. So it becomes a very case by case operation.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arsc.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1249/collection_resources/39621/file/111110#t=2824.0,2927.0"},{"id":"https://arsc.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1249/collection_resources/39621/file/111110/transcript/34390/annotation/37","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Request for formats we currently don't have experience with is really just an excuse for me to learn another format, buy new gear, set it all up. The only downfall is that the individual that brings in something that we haven't yet sort of figured out has to wait a little bit longer to have access to their content. Storage is a huge orange bubble. Storage and maintenance of the digital files, I think is going to be something it's going to take us quite a while to sort of make a little green, make it a little more green. Many of the people who were bring media for us to digitize they don't have computers at home and they request that we're putting their content on a CD for them. Well, that's fine. We can do that. It's easy. But then how do you provide them a preservation file or do we even worry about keeping preservation files? Now we started out by putting everything on an external hard drive for people, so they get their CD and they get their external hard drive. And then I say, Don't lose this, don't get it wet. Don't put it somewhere where it's going to get too hot and make sure you bring it back to me in a few years so that we can check for corruption and migrate it, potentially migrate it to something else. That's a ton of work for somebody to do, for something that they don't even have access to. It's like a hunk of metal and plastic. So do we suggest more strongly that people keep a preservation file with us or do we care for that external hard drive? What does that look like? You know what happens when the original, if we are hosting and keeping files for people that person who asked us to do that work one day if they're no longer here, do their children, grandchildren, cousins have access to it.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arsc.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1249/collection_resources/39621/file/111110#t=2927.0,3061.0"},{"id":"https://arsc.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1249/collection_resources/39621/file/111110/transcript/34390/annotation/38","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So it's just all of these questions and that sort of bleeds into donor agreements. And if people are donating materials, then, you know, do they have access? Sorry, and the people who are donating materials, do they provide open access so anyone in the community can access it or just particular people? What does that look like? What if somebody down the road changes their mind? You know, you're always thinking, have to think beyond an individual's lifetime and who can make decisions about that material 10, 20, 50 years down the road. So these are kind of all of the questions that we wrestle with and don't have answers for. So don't ask me. And then just to end on, this is our shelving for our community digitization deposits. And I look at this and think, gosh, I still have a lot of work to do and I can't wait till COVID's over so I can get back into the office. But it also reminds me about how far we've come in the last five years, so I'm really thankful, I'm sorry, really thankful to the community for starting to trust us. Sorry, guys.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arsc.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1249/collection_resources/39621/file/111110#t=3061.0,3154.0"},{"id":"https://arsc.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1249/collection_resources/39621/file/111110/transcript/34390/annotation/39","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"[thank you], [0.0s] thank you. \n\nYuri Shimoda","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arsc.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1249/collection_resources/39621/file/111110#t=3154.0,3164.0"},{"id":"https://arsc.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1249/collection_resources/39621/file/111110/transcript/34390/annotation/40","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Yes. Thank you so much, Elizabeth and Gerry, for your informative and just wonderfully heartfelt presentations. We have so many questions that have been submitted right now and previous to the webinar. I just wanted to start with a question that Gerry had already answered in the chat, but it bears repeating. Mariah had asked if these resources are only available in Canada or can tribal archivists in the U.S. Also access access them? \n\nGerry Lawson","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arsc.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1249/collection_resources/39621/file/111110#t=3164.0,3197.0"},{"id":"https://arsc.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1249/collection_resources/39621/file/111110/transcript/34390/annotation/41","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So, yeah, quickly all of our resources are essentially open access. So we speak about keeping the knowledge from communities from needing to be open access, but we want these to be. This started as a pilot project that we didn't think would go anywhere, to be frank. As you know, we've never been resourced to do the thing we love to do before. Why would it happen now? That really, we've designed everything to be as broadly accessible and useful as they can be, and that doesn't just mean indigenous organizations. I think they're useful to any small organizations that are trying to do good practical work and useful to larger organization to see where their gaps might be when they're suggesting best practices. So and I would like to say that Musqueam is, I mean, Jason is absolutely foundational in the program in that it was sort of the two of us before and indigitization was a thing yelling into the void about the problems. We would talk all the time. So his voice is in our program from the ground up and and their organization has built in such a mindful way that they are what I was thinking about in terms of people digitizing, digitizing useful material, making it useful to the community, getting resourced from core budgets. And they've gone from having a couple of desks in the band office with literal file boxes as walls, to having a beautiful space that can that has a view of the river. So it's like they are the sort of the prototype to follow. They really are. And and it's not a, you know, it's not happenstance that Elizabeth is here. They're doing such great work in sort of everything that I was hoping would happen for community organizations. And there are certainly others that are doing great work as well, but it's wonderful to see so. \n\nDan Hockstein","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arsc.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1249/collection_resources/39621/file/111110#t=3197.0,3314.0"},{"id":"https://arsc.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1249/collection_resources/39621/file/111110/transcript/34390/annotation/42","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Thanks so much, and I think we're probably going to run a few minutes over if that's okay with you Gerry and Elizabeth, just to take a few more questions. And I'm going to go ahead and take one that was previously submitted, which is how do you handle re-use requests, especially with regards to consent of the community? Elizabeth I know you touched on this a little bit, but maybe more specifically, you know, with regards to access for something like a documentary film is what I imagine the document. \n\nElizabeth McManus","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arsc.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1249/collection_resources/39621/file/111110#t=3314.0,3349.0"},{"id":"https://arsc.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1249/collection_resources/39621/file/111110/transcript/34390/annotation/43","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Yeah. So access and use is really determined by the donor. So if it's material that was created by somebody who is working for the band, so we consider those band records, and then got transferred to the archives. That's a little bit different. We'll probably go through chief and counsel regarding those requests. But if it's donor material, somebody donates something from the community, then we very much do our best to not be gatekeepers. And so really, we're caretakers and we would have to reach out to the donor or the donor's family to figure out sort of how to proceed. And and the problem with these requests is people tend to want things yesterday, but that's not how it works. It has to, you have to go through the appropriate steps in order to get there. You can't rush these things. So to anyone who ever wants to request use of something from a community, think of it way ahead of time and, you know, go down, meet with the community, meet with the families, you know, explain your projects and then they will tell you how it can be useful to them and how it should be presented and what steps to take. \n\nGerry Lawson","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arsc.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1249/collection_resources/39621/file/111110#t=3349.0,3444.0"},{"id":"https://arsc.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1249/collection_resources/39621/file/111110/transcript/34390/annotation/44","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Do you have a language authority board or anything, Elizabeth? That sort of helps moderate these things? \n\nElizabeth McManus","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arsc.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1249/collection_resources/39621/file/111110#t=3444.0,3450.0"},{"id":"https://arsc.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1249/collection_resources/39621/file/111110/transcript/34390/annotation/45","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"No. \n\nGerry Lawson","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arsc.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1249/collection_resources/39621/file/111110#t=3450.0,3451.0"},{"id":"https://arsc.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1249/collection_resources/39621/file/111110/transcript/34390/annotation/46","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"OK. I think a couple of things are worth saying from my point of view is that I'm really largely technical, which means that I don't manage any collection. I don't. I help digitize things for people within my job, but then I push them out the door with those things. So I don't have to worry about access. There are a lot of things that I don't have to worry about, which makes me ill-equipped to manage, to create guides for, a lot of things that Elizabeth's team is really taking the lead on creating around collections, description, and access. But within my own community, it's worth knowing from the outside that indigenous communities are all healing from different things at different rates. And there are things, the discussions, we haven't had in the community that require modernizing our indigenous protocols to allow for digital access. And so things like language authority boards that can be an authority over all language materials, whether or not those things can be accessed by external researchers, linguists by internal people for specific projects. Those are incredibly important, but they're also growing, so they will not always make great decisions and they will not always make timely decisions. But that's what you live with in terms of creating these capacities to make good decisions over the long term. So sort of keep that in mind if you're working with indigenous communities. Those communities are going to make their own decisions. And whether you agree with them or not, whether they have the capacity to work with you on your schedule or not, really, it's things are all getting better across the board, but they at different rates, in different places, for different communities. So. \n\nYuri Shimoda","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arsc.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1249/collection_resources/39621/file/111110#t=3451.0,3558.0"},{"id":"https://arsc.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1249/collection_resources/39621/file/111110/transcript/34390/annotation/47","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"We we have a question about outreach. I am interested in learning actors. I'm interested in working with communities, but curious about how the word gets out. How does the community learn about the program? This is from Ann. \n\nGerry Lawson","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arsc.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1249/collection_resources/39621/file/111110#t=3558.0,3577.0"},{"id":"https://arsc.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1249/collection_resources/39621/file/111110/transcript/34390/annotation/48","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Like how did you learn about indigenization or about? \n\nYuri Shimoda","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arsc.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1249/collection_resources/39621/file/111110#t=3577.0,3582.0"},{"id":"https://arsc.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1249/collection_resources/39621/file/111110/transcript/34390/annotation/49","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Yeah, I would imagine that's what she's asking. \n\nGerry Lawson","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arsc.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1249/collection_resources/39621/file/111110#t=3582.0,3586.0"},{"id":"https://arsc.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1249/collection_resources/39621/file/111110/transcript/34390/annotation/50","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So for us, we're funded by a part of the UBC library system that has a mandate for British Columbia. So for our own province, which has sort of nicely bounded us in that we're not trying to solve this problem for the entire world or for Canada or for North America. But our new resources have been developed under funding from the National Research Council. So that is a Canadian body. And so our new research sets are definitely, like I said, everything is sort of widely available. But for us, we've done sort of radio advertising and we've done advertising sort of outreach through different organizations in British Columbia. But, you know, it's sort of the language and information technology management communities are relatively small and tight-knit, even though it's very diverse here in British Columbia. So I think most people know about us at this point. Sort of more broadly, I don't know. I don't know what outreach looks like for us sort of more broadly. And I would say that Kayla Larson, who who's our new sort of project coordinator, program coordinator, comes from Edmonton and brings different capacities and relationships to the table. And she'll probably take on a lot of that. What it means for us to be a more expansive program that supports at least advice more broadly than British Columbia. Because it's been a nice boundary for us, it sort of kept things to a palatable, like manageable size and not overwhelmed us. But, you know, the problem is much greater and more far reaching. So I don't know how to answer that. \n\nDan Hockstein","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arsc.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1249/collection_resources/39621/file/111110#t=3586.0,3688.0"},{"id":"https://arsc.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1249/collection_resources/39621/file/111110/transcript/34390/annotation/51","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Thanks, Gerry. I think we're just going to we're going to leave off one more question that was also submitted, which is what specific practices can be included into a sort of active records management. I know you talked about quality control for hard drives. Is there anything you can speak on to that that you might not have touched on? \n\nElizabeth McManus","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arsc.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1249/collection_resources/39621/file/111110#t=3688.0,3710.0"},{"id":"https://arsc.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1249/collection_resources/39621/file/111110/transcript/34390/annotation/52","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Yeah. Well, I also sort of wonder, like today, active records are going to be recorded digitally, so you're not going to end up with analog recordings that you then digitize and have to manage. They're already starting with a digital file. And yeah, you sort of have to look at what's best for you. What what can your organization handle right now? And then maybe what can you, what will you be able to handle five years from now? Like, you have to remember that you're going to grow and you're going to find funding to do things differently in the future. So, don't necessarily lock yourself in. This is really more of a question for Kevin if he was here to answer, records management practices and policies. But in terms of like, if you're having audio recordings of your meeting, I'd say that's probably the most common recording that you're going to get in an administrative sense, turn the tape off after the meeting is done. We generally have a policy at Musqueam, and this kind of comes with with legal issues, that we maintain the entire recording.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arsc.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1249/collection_resources/39621/file/111110#t=3710.0,3808.0"},{"id":"https://arsc.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1249/collection_resources/39621/file/111110/transcript/34390/annotation/53","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So I have recordings that I have digitized where the meeting ends and you hear people leave the room, you hear them get into their vehicles and drive away. And then I'm sitting there listening to just the room. But, you know, we have to keep all of this and that takes up space because we're storing it in, you know, a lossless format. And so it's little things like that that you can also try to implement into your policies. So if you know, if that happens, you know, you don't need to keep eight hours of digital recording if seven hours of it are silence. Things like this that you can sort of think through. But again, I should maybe throw my email in the chat and then people can reach out if you have further questions and I can pass you on to Kevin, who would would be able to answer this more eloquently than I can. I'll do that now. \n\nGerry Lawson","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arsc.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1249/collection_resources/39621/file/111110#t=3808.0,3868.0"},{"id":"https://arsc.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1249/collection_resources/39621/file/111110/transcript/34390/annotation/54","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And Dan, I realized that that I didn't at all see the Q\u0026A chat. So there are a couple of questions that came up that if I can just quickly address. I have no idea what instantaneous discs are. So I'm sorry, Christopher, but in looking at outside digitization experts, one thing we had expected to put together but haven't yet but will is an outsourcing guide for communities. It may or may not include it in such discs if I figure out what they. We're trying to bring people to be more comfortable with outsourcing. And we find after people have run a digitization project, they are much more comfortable sending things out to somebody once they know what that technical transfer looks like. What questions to ask and have an understanding of how people can keep things privileged and not steal cultural information? So for the does grant allow for storage access hosting labor? The answer is yes, but within the limits of a sort of defined project. So if we have a six month audio digitization project, the storage for that is quite limited to what's needed. I mean, we we do ask people to over buy their storage because buying exactly what you need for a project seems stupid and we don't recommend it. So we allow for a little bit of expansion in terms of hard disk. And if people can justify server space for the duration of the project or a certain term after, we will sort of consider and usually fund that. We are bridging into a pilot project where we're helping to buy a server in a community, and we're looking at partnering with what's called the, I believe it's the Open Learning Network, but I'm probably getting that wrong. But it's a group that hosts collections for the B.C. History Digitization Project and a number of different post-secondaries and has really, really good archival backend work. So it's not cheap. So we're sort of looking at pushing people towards images first trying to figure out what the appetite is, whether or not communities have that trust level yet to be trusting a repository-style system. So we're really looking at that storage issue, and the long term storage issue, and trying to sort of attack it from all ends, whether it's community servers, whether it's university partnerships, whatever it looks like, we're trying to figure that out. So. And cloud servers, I mean, cloud servers are just servers over the internet. Do you trust them? I would say that cloud servers are getting better in terms of having Canadian instances, so not worrying about things like the Patriot Act in terms of private information. So we are finding there are additional things like Microsoft and Amazon have Canadian instances where you can guarantee your data stays in Canada.\n\nElizabeth McManus","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arsc.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1249/collection_resources/39621/file/111110#t=3868.0,4048.0"},{"id":"https://arsc.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1249/collection_resources/39621/file/111110/transcript/34390/annotation/55","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Which is important. I would say anyone who's thinking about a cloud server, make sure that that is the case. Don't let your data go out of the country. \n\nYuri Shimoda","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arsc.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1249/collection_resources/39621/file/111110#t=4048.0,4061.0"},{"id":"https://arsc.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1249/collection_resources/39621/file/111110/transcript/34390/annotation/56","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"OK, well, you can learn about instantaneous discs, also known as lacquer discs or acetate discs ften they're called, at the ARSC Conference, which is coming up May 12th to 15th. I will go ahead and put the link to the conference website in the chat. Hope to see some of you there at the conference. There's going to be an introduction to ARSC event for anyone who isn't a member yet but thinking about it. And that is on the conference website under mentoring program. We will hopefully be coming back to you with more webinars later this year after the conference. But we did want to go ahead and thank the Outreach Committee who helped us promote the webinar, the board for funding the webinar series, and also to Gerry and Elizabeth. Thank you so much for your time, your thoughtful presentations, and looking forward to talking to you some more next time. Take care.\n\nDan Hockstein","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arsc.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1249/collection_resources/39621/file/111110#t=4061.0,4135.0"},{"id":"https://arsc.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1249/collection_resources/39621/file/111110/transcript/34390/annotation/57","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Thank you all for coming. Appreciate it. \n\nGerry Lawson","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arsc.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1249/collection_resources/39621/file/111110#t=4135.0,4139.0"},{"id":"https://arsc.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1249/collection_resources/39621/file/111110/transcript/34390/annotation/58","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Thank you, everybody.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://arsc.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1249/collection_resources/39621/file/111110#t=4139.0,4154.96533"}]}]}]}